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kirby
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Joined: Oct 09 2007
Location: bay area,california
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Points: 1088
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Posted: Jun 05 2008 at 8:43pm |
Katie,
I always assumed that that was why I was whisked, slam, bam, thank-you maam, into surgical biopsy. My tumor was obviously cancer as seen by the ultrasound. I have always wondered if some women get core biopsy's because of the uncertainty of what will be found, even though cancer is the suspect.
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kirby
dx Feb. 2001. Age 44 Lumpectomy
2cm. no nodes stage 1 grade 3
4 rnds AC, 35 rads
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Winkie
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Joined: Jan 09 2008
Location: United States
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Points: 8
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Posted: Jun 06 2008 at 4:14am |
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Yes, Katie, I thought that it was quite logical to assume that the invasiveness of the core biopsy would spread cancer cells throughout the body. My breast was completely black after my biopsy. I kept looking at it saying to myself, "Hmm, broke open the tumor. Broke open my blood vessels. Everything swimming around together. Not good."
Later, I asked my surgeon about it. He agreed there is a school of thought that believes biopsies spread cancer cells. I'm sure he wasn't supposed to tell me that. The insurance and pharmaceutical industries keep a tight lid on what doctors are allowed to tell patients (truth or not).
Keep thinking! Never blindly follow what your doctors say. It's your body and your life. Believe it or not, YOU know best.
Winkie
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ravenhawk
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Joined: May 21 2008
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Posted: Jun 06 2008 at 8:27am |
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this post is wonderful. I am currently in the to chemo or not to chemo stage. My cancer was only 2mm but I am 35 yrs old. my oncologist recommends chemo because of my age. The bc specialist however is telling me he doesnt think its necessary because the cancer was so small. I had a left mastectomy, clear margins, nodes negative. We dont know positively that I am triple neg because there wasnt enough invasive tissue to stain for the Her2 test. The specialist says 10% or less chance of recurrence with a 2-3 % benefit of reduction from chemo. Do I do everything in my power and do the chemo (4 treatments of taxotere & cytoxan) or play the odds and see what happens? I dont know yet. I am being tested for the BRCA1/2 but havent had the test done yet.
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colleen
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Joined: Jun 02 2008
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Posted: Jun 10 2008 at 7:23am |
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Cece: I am opting not to have chemo. Dx april 08, Triple neg., stage 1, 1.8 cm, Grade 3, no nodes. How are you doing?
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sportress
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Joined: Aug 13 2007
Location: United States
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Posted: Jun 10 2008 at 7:47am |
Hi Colleen
it has been almost 6 yrs since i had surgery (aug 23). We are almost the same diagnosis wise. i am fine, and still have a smile on my face everyday that i refused chemo. i suffer from bad radiation damage, but the rad doc i was assigned to (i didnot even know i could look for one) was a PROSTATE SPECIALIST, and not breast cancer, so i screwed up by not checking him out,and he screwed up because i did not have the right equipment. My surgeon was not worried about the triple neg at all. She said after 2 yrs it all evens out. and i read an article on medline the other day that stated that triple negs who make it 5 yrs the rate of recurrance goes to almost zero unlike the other folks, theirs stays the same. i will look for the article for you.
cece
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colleen
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Posted: Jun 11 2008 at 3:10am |
Winkie: In lay terms, What does this mean to you? What is HR? What is CI? What is Central Fibrosis?
Multivariable analysis showed that a large amount of lymphocytic infiltrate (HR = 0.30, 95% CI 0.09–0.96) and absence of central fibrosis in the tumors (HR = 0.14, 95% CI 0.03–0.62) were associated with distant metastasis-free survival.
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Winkie
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Posted: Jun 11 2008 at 9:19am |
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Colleen,
Those numbers in the parentheses usually are statistics referring to the study group.
Central fibrosis is a necrotic (dead) region that sometimes appears in the center of tumors. From what I understand, this dead zone develops because the tumor is growing so fast it cannot "feed" itself sufficiently. This can be seen as an indication of an unresponsive immune system.
The presence of the lymphocytic infiltrate they talk about is indicative of an immune system response. I believe that's why the study showed that people with moderate to extensive lymphocytic infiltrate had a lesser re-occurrence rate -- because their immune system was attempting to respond.
Here is a quote from the study that quantifies what "moderate to extensive" lymphocytic infiltrate is, as well as a clinical definition of a central necrotic zone. I literally copied this and gave it to my pathologist.
"The amount of lymphocytic infiltrate was scored as follows: none = no lymphocytes present; minimal = scattered lymphocytes, <10 lymphocytes per high power field (40x); moderate = lymphocytes easily identified, but no large aggregates; extensive = large aggregates of lymphocytes in >50% of the tumor. Central fibrosis was deemed to be present when the center of the tumor showed collagen, with a variable amount of fibroblasts, without tumor cells."
Now, remember, there were only 71 cases used in this study. There are so few studies on Triple Negative, I was grateful to find this one, but it's not much to go on. My pathology came back with moderate lymphocytic infiltrate and no central fibrosis. That, in combination with my overall good health and negative test for BRCA1/2, led me to my decision to forgo chemo.
Again -- DISCLAIMER -- I am not a doctor! I am not qualified to give medical advice in any way!
Good luck,
Winkie
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