You call this his divine plan? |
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Scott 
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Joined: Dec 08 2009 Location: Arkansas Status: Offline Points: 126 |
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 Topic: You call this his divine plan?Posted: Jan 03 2011 at 3:11pm |
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My faith has never been shaken like it has been watching all the tragedy that has struck so many of our members & their families over the last few months.....innocent children left motherless, loving spouses left alone to pick up the pieces of shattered families and dreams, women putting up the fight of their lives, seemingly all for naught.......someone please explain to me, what part of this could even be considered part of Gods divine plan.
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123Donna
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Joined: Aug 24 2009 Location: St. Louis, MO Status: Offline Points: 13510 |
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Posted: Jan 03 2011 at 3:49pm |
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Scott,
I ask the same questions myself. Donna |
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DX IDC TNBC 6/09 age 49, Stage 1,Grade 3, 1.5cm,0/5Nodes,KI-67 48%,BRCA-,6/09bi-mx, recon, T/C X4(9/09)
11/10 Recur IM node, Gem,Carb,Iniparib 12/10,MRI NED 2/11,IMRT Radsx40,CT NED11/13,MRI NED3/15 |
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dmwolf
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Joined: Jan 22 2009 Location: Berkeley, CA Status: Offline Points: 3619 |
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Posted: Jan 03 2011 at 5:25pm |
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That might be the one benefit of being at heart an atheist: I don't expect life to make sense or be fair.
From my heathen perspective, it's up to us to put 'God' in the equation, in the form of love and generosity -the power of human goodness. Of that force I have no doubt. |
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DX 2/08@43 stg II IDC; gr2,0 nodes. Neoadj chemo, first ACx2 (fail) then CarboTaxotereX6(better). Lump, Rads done 11/08; Clodronate. False alarm queen: PetCT lung & TM marker. NED. PBM w/recon 9/10.
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TNBC_in_NS
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Joined: Jul 26 2009 Location: NS Canada Status: Offline Points: 2028 |
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Posted: Jan 03 2011 at 5:38pm |
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No Scott:
This is not His Divine Plan....He does not want us to suffer as He did, but this world has created its own hell. The water we drink, food we eat, the medication we take without question, the pollution in the air, the asbestos that is man-made, and what else we never know. Some is genetic but the rest is man made to change the DNA to make the changes in our bodies.
Take some deep breaths and rethink your reasons for the anger we all feel ....Hugs, Helen in NS
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Diag@57TNBC04/092.5cm Lquad 05/09 TCx4Radsx30CT03/01/10 FU03/31/10ClearBRCA- 01/2011 RTNBC BMX 06/14/2011~2013 clear
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zoomommy2
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Joined: Sep 26 2009 Location: Denver, CO Status: Offline Points: 1356 |
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Posted: Jan 03 2011 at 5:39pm |
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I have never been angry at God for my breast cancer. I have been angry when those that are younger than my 65 years have had to endure this beast. It's not fair and it's not right, but nobody made me the decider of these things. I hope we will all understand the Plan someday. Surely we don't understand right now.
Lee in Denver
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dx6/09,stageII,gr3,(L)mastectomy 7/09,ACx4,Taxolx7,Avastin study,gall bladder surgery 1/10,4/11 Stage 4, mets to lung, 4/11 Started Taxotere and Xeloda, 5/11 Taxotere stopped, off Xeloda
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LauraT
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Joined: May 05 2010 Location: Georgia Status: Offline Points: 739 |
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Posted: Jan 03 2011 at 6:17pm |
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Scott,
I, too, ask “Why?” My finite mind cannot grasp how this horrible suffering can possibly be good. As I was sitting here thinking about this, my 20-year old son came in and I asked his thoughts. He says that it helps him to think of it in terms of how a parent allows a child they love to experience pain for reasons they cannot understand. The example he gave is giving a child a vaccine. The child hates the pain of the shot and fears getting the shot but the parent, who loves the child and knows that if he does not get the shot he could get a very bad disease, has them get the shot. The child’s knowledge and experience is limited compared to that of his parent so they cannot comprehend why their mom or dad is allowing them to experience pain. Are we like the child and God the parent? The pain and suffering make no sense to us and we cannot see beyond our finite view. I don’t believe God wants us to suffer, but for some reason He allows it. He has promised to make good come of it for those who love Him and believe in Him. The best example of this is His allowing His own Son Jesus to suffer and die so that we might have peace with Him and be called His. God did not exempt Himself from the brokenness of the world; He does not love us from afar, but became one of us and lived among us, experiencing all that we experience, even death. While this doesn’t answer the questions of why, maybe it brings us some measure of strength and faith to continue trusting Him. Laura |
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DX 10/09 @44, Stage I IDC tnbc, DCIS other side, Neoadjuvant TCx4, Bilateral Mastectomy w/Recon 1/10, 1.2cm 0/7 Nodes, 5/11 Mets to Lungs/Lymph Nodes, Avastin/Taxol, 10/11 Bone Mets, Xgeva
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johnmc
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Joined: Jun 18 2010 Location: NJ Status: Offline Points: 47 |
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Posted: Jan 03 2011 at 6:25pm |
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To All who may be interested.
The famous author C. S. Lewis ( he wrote the Chronicles of Narnia), wrote a book called the
"Problem of Pain", which attempts to answer this very question. C S was originally an atheist,
but became a Christian after losing his wife ( I think to cancer), which is kind of interesting.
He explores the question of why bad things are allowed to happen to good people in this book and attempts to give perspective to the bigger question of why a merciful God would allow bad things to happen in HIS world. Well worth reading as are many of his other books.
John - husband of wife with met tnbc
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LRM216
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Joined: Mar 18 2009 Location: Marietta, GA Status: Offline Points: 1196 |
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Posted: Jan 03 2011 at 6:39pm |
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It isn't His Divine Plan at all. This is life - I don't believe for one second that God's hand enters into what happens to us here. I believe his mercy comes in - and took Caryn - and took Diane, when nothing further could be done but to suffer miserably. Just as I don't believe GOd takes innocent babies and gives children cancer - surely this can't be considered part of any divine plan.
Life sucks sometimes, and this breast cancer does even more so. From the day I was diagnosed I felt what my future will hold with this disease would be a total roll of the dice. I used every gun in the arsenal to fight it, but will I win? Only time will tell, but whether or not I do, I certainly do not blame God. He'll be there for me - even if it's only to take me home.
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Linda - diagnosed at age 62
Diag 2/23/09 IDC 1.2 cent. IDC right breast,Stage 1, Grade 3,0/1 nodes - Triple Neg 4 DD AC every two weeks, 1 Dd Taxol, then 3 Taxotere every three weeks - rads x 33 |
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Lillie
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Joined: Jul 10 2009 Location: Eastern NC Status: Offline Points: 3616 |
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Posted: Jan 03 2011 at 6:43pm |
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Dear Scott and All,
I don't think these deaths are part of God's "Divine" Plan. Mankind is working as fast as "it" can to tarnish and pollute everything on this earth. From that pollution and such comes most of the woes of man and womankind. But knowing this doesn't take away your pain. Also, God is BIG enough to handle any of our doubts and fist shaking. He doesn't blame us for hurting and being angry. Some of the most despicable, haneous, awful things that happen in this world have resulted in good things happening. This knowledge is the only way my mind can stay sane sometimes. The discovery of new drugs due to horrible plagues and sicknesses (polio, scarlet fever, typhoid fever to name a few), A park in memory of a 5 year old child that was raped, murdered and discarded like a chicken bone. (Children go there everyday and play and enjoy the beautiful world that God has created). Learning labs in memory of an awful car accident that took a 16 year olds life. (Students have access to computers, teachers, mentors, and many other things they can't afford). College scholarships in memory of a 17 year old girl who was kidnapped, raped and shot the day after her high school graduation. (Young people getting a college education through the generosity of people working to keep the memory of a loved one in a POSITIVE place. A wonderful and growing soccer tournament "The Brittany" in memory of another girl who was kidnapped, raped and murdered. (Girls and boys from all over the US come to play on this soccer field in these tournaments). The Coach V golf tournament in memory of Jim Valvano has raised millions for cancer research. The Kay Yow foundation founded to raise money for breast cancer research. The Komen foundation founded by a sister in memory of a sister who didn't survive breast cancer. Please don't blame God for these tradegies, and Please don't ever think that these wonderful women's lives have been in vain. Some of the greatest tragedies have brought forth some of our most beautiful music that has ministered to millions. (Go Fly High) by Vince Gill in memory of his brother who died from cancer. (This song has brought solace and peace to countless millions of people). If anyone has told you that the death of your wife from cancer was God's Divine Plan, shame on them. But, from pain comes some of the most precious things in life. If you agree or not that's OK. I just know that I serve an AWESOME GOD! God Bless, Lillie |
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Dx 6/06 age 65,IDC-TNBC
Stage IIb,Gr3,2cm,BRCA- 6/06 L/Mast/w/SNB,1of3 Nodes+ 6/06 Axl. 9 nodes- 8/8 thru 11/15 Chemo (Clin-Trial) DD A/Cx4 -- DD taxol+gemzar x4 No Rads. No RECON - 11/2018-12 yrs NED |
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mainsailset
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Joined: Jul 27 2008 Location: Washington State Status: Offline Points: 5004 |
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Posted: Jan 03 2011 at 7:15pm |
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My mom used to explain to us kids that she believed we were given the breath of life, the tools of compassion, curiosity and the goal to make the world a better place. She didn't particularly believe in God but if pushed she would cock her head and say she believed that God was a verb. It took me years to put the pieces of my puzzle together and I can still say that lots of those pieces are cockeyed and need to be rethought. But in the end, I believe she was trying to tell me that there was no divine plan that would make any God right, wrong, loving or cruel; instead he left things up to us to move forward. There are many days, that is simply too much to ask but there it is.
I said to Donna the other day that many of us have been the backbone of our families, the go to person who never complains, always the caregiver; and now, when we are personally faced with such tragedy, such fear and loss we back away from asking for help, for voicing our pain.
But we must remember. We must understand that we are the frontline of cancer, we truly are the warriors, not the researchers, not the doctors, US. We are the ones who are poked and prodded, who are tested and experimented on so that not only may we live a full and productive life, survive and be repaired, but so that those that follow have a better chance than we have. Yes, we are the frontline and that means the pain and loss of those we so cherish here is ever so profound for there is no one to buffer us from the rawness of it all.
Like you, at the moment I cannot make sense of all this but I do hold onto the thought that God is a verb.
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dx 7/08 TN 14x6.5x5.5 cm tumor
3 Lymph nodes involved, Taxol/Sunitab+AC, 5/09 dbl masectomy, path 2mm tumor removed, lymphs all clear, RAD 32 finished 9/11/09. 9/28 CT clear 10/18/10 CT clear |
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TNBC_in_NS
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Joined: Jul 26 2009 Location: NS Canada Status: Offline Points: 2028 |
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Posted: Jan 03 2011 at 7:20pm |
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Well said John Mc, Lillie & Mainy!!
Hugs, h. Edited by TNBC_in_NS - Jan 03 2011 at 7:21pm |
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Diag@57TNBC04/092.5cm Lquad 05/09 TCx4Radsx30CT03/01/10 FU03/31/10ClearBRCA- 01/2011 RTNBC BMX 06/14/2011~2013 clear
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LRM216
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Joined: Mar 18 2009 Location: Marietta, GA Status: Offline Points: 1196 |
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Posted: Jan 03 2011 at 7:22pm |
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Ooooh, I enjoyed your post Mainy, and can so relate. I was raised with a strict Catholic background that I, even as a child going through it all, was never comfortable with - to the great dismay of my family, and even still causes some bumps to this day. Your mom's saying "God is a verb" fits so well with my feelings. Thanks for sharing that. |
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Linda - diagnosed at age 62
Diag 2/23/09 IDC 1.2 cent. IDC right breast,Stage 1, Grade 3,0/1 nodes - Triple Neg 4 DD AC every two weeks, 1 Dd Taxol, then 3 Taxotere every three weeks - rads x 33 |
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pamurph
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Joined: Dec 14 2009 Location: Texas Status: Offline Points: 48 |
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Posted: Jan 05 2011 at 9:56pm |
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All of these comments demonstrate why this forum is so dynamic and helps so many people. The freedom to vent, and diverse answers that offer support to differing beliefs, and stages of illness. I am so thankful for all who post on this site.
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Dec 2009
IDC 1.6 Stage 1 Grade 3 Lt Lumpectomy, mammosite radiation completed; 6 Taxotere/Cytoxan treatments-1-4 2010. Port out 6/3. Rt breast LCIS dx 8-2010. Bil Mx 9/2/2010 w/ reconstruction |
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