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unklez View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote unklez Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec 20 2009 at 12:50am
Dear Scott,

Given that your wife is pregnant, please triple check with the obgyn AND oncologist before starting to follow recommendations from us non-qualified people. Since the Vitamin D test has been ordered, I think it would be prudent to wait for the results before starting to load up on any mineral or vitamin using a supplement. A few days should not make a difference in any case.

What I'd suggest you do in the meantime is read up on papers from Vitamin D council that Mainy points to and use them to educate your medical team on the difference between D3 and D2. Also know that 5K IU of D3 is available OTC on vitaminshoppe.com (and many other such places) at a reasonable price.


Wife Dx: Jul/09. Age: 37. Size: 3cm. BRCA: -ve. Lumpectomy: Aug/09. Micromet 1/9 node. Chemo Start: Sep/09. E5103. DD ACB-> DD Abraxane (Taxol reaction). Zometa (S0307). Canadian Fraction Rads.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 123Donna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec 28 2009 at 7:05pm
I wanted to give an update on my D3 levels.  I checked my D3 level a few weeks after finishing chemo and it was 19, very low.  My D3 level was never checked at DX.   I started taking D3 (between 5,000 to 6,000 iu) a day along with 2 Citracel and a multivitamin.  After about 8 weeks, my onc checked my D3 levels and it came back 47. 

Donna
DX IDC TNBC 6/09 age 49, Stage 1,Grade 3, 1.5cm,0/5Nodes,KI-67 48%,BRCA-,6/09bi-mx, recon, T/C X4(9/09)
11/10 Recur IM node, Gem,Carb,Iniparib 12/10,MRI NED 2/11,IMRT Radsx40,CT NED11/13,MRI NED3/15

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Scott View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Scott Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec 29 2009 at 10:07am
We got my wifes Vit D tests back last week, her level was 34, after double checking with the obgyn she has started taking 3000IU daily. I'm having a hard time finding the calciun/mag supplement which he also was fine with, all the ones I seem to find also include zinc...is that the right one to take?
 
Scott
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mainsailset Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec 29 2009 at 10:36am
A bit FYI for everyone. I've been the one taking the mega doses since June...8,000 IU a day along with the CalMag. My levels as of last Monday came back in at 60. Since the Vit Council suggests a range of 60-90 for cancer patients I was feelin pretty sassy.
 
BUT, my cholesterol levels had skyrocketed and my thryoid is going wrong direction as well. Since I would prefer not to just treat symptoms I have been on a massive Google search for possible answers and I have to say that the newest articles I'm finding point toward the massive doses of D as a contributor. There's been no studies, no research on this but there are rumblings going on. So I'll be going back to the 2,000 IU a day that Linus Pauling Institute recommends and see how that works.
 
Scott:  here's an article on why the zinc is a good one   http://www.nutrasanus.com/calcium-magnesium-zinc.html
 


Edited by mainsailset - Dec 29 2009 at 10:40am
dx 7/08 TN 14x6.5x5.5 cm tumor

3 Lymph nodes involved, Taxol/Sunitab+AC, 5/09 dbl masectomy, path 2mm tumor removed, lymphs all clear, RAD 32 finished 9/11/09. 9/28 CT clear 10/18/10 CT clear
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 123Donna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec 29 2009 at 6:36pm
Originally posted by mainsailset mainsailset wrote:

A bit FYI for everyone. I've been the one taking the mega doses since June...8,000 IU a day along with the CalMag. My levels as of last Monday came back in at 60. Since the Vit Council suggests a range of 60-90 for cancer patients I was feelin pretty sassy.
 
BUT, my cholesterol levels had skyrocketed and my thryoid is going wrong direction as well. Since I would prefer not to just treat symptoms I have been on a massive Google search for possible answers and I have to say that the newest articles I'm finding point toward the massive doses of D as a contributor. There's been no studies, no research on this but there are rumblings going on. So I'll be going back to the 2,000 IU a day that Linus Pauling Institute recommends and see how that works.


Mainsailset,

I was also worried about my thyroid and cholesterol levels after chemo and how tx affected them.  I just recently had both checked and my thyroid was normal and cholesterol was 156. 

Donna
DX IDC TNBC 6/09 age 49, Stage 1,Grade 3, 1.5cm,0/5Nodes,KI-67 48%,BRCA-,6/09bi-mx, recon, T/C X4(9/09)
11/10 Recur IM node, Gem,Carb,Iniparib 12/10,MRI NED 2/11,IMRT Radsx40,CT NED11/13,MRI NED3/15

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mainsailset Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec 29 2009 at 7:16pm
Donna that's really good news. I've been substantially annoyed to discover that a common side effect of chemo is a poor thyroid performance. I just found one FDA notice about Sutent as of Oct. 08 and NO ONE MENTIONED IT TO ME as I was on Sutent at the time!
 
Once I started putting all this together I thought it important to get the word out so ladies could get themselves tested and start on the path toward healing their poor systems after all this treatment stuff.
 
dx 7/08 TN 14x6.5x5.5 cm tumor

3 Lymph nodes involved, Taxol/Sunitab+AC, 5/09 dbl masectomy, path 2mm tumor removed, lymphs all clear, RAD 32 finished 9/11/09. 9/28 CT clear 10/18/10 CT clear
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MsBliss Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec 29 2009 at 7:17pm
Just wanted to add my layman's two cents....re multivitamins and zinc.  My naturopath said he would prefer that I don't take a multivitamin with any added copper or zinc.  His opinion is that extra copper as well as extra zinc are utilized by malignant cells; he wasn't concerned with dietary base levels, just adding supplemental forms.  Has anyone heard of this?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Nancy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec 29 2009 at 7:56pm
Mainy,
 
Articles....and from all that I am reading lately, this is a good thing. This cholesterol "thing" is highly over rated. I read a post from a woman on another bc site that she had a "disabled thyroid which causes very high cholesterol".
 
 
 
 
 
 
Nancy
DD Lori dx TNBC June 13,2007
Lumpectomy due to incorrect dx of a cyst
mastectomy July 6 2007
chemo ACT all 3 every 3 weeks 6 tx Aug-Nov
28 rads ended Jan 2008
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote unklez Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec 29 2009 at 8:35pm
Mainy,

Nancy's linked article says something important, ie total cholestrol is nowhere as important as the breakdown. Also, I am not sure a 10% variation is material. My total levels report anywhere from 150 to 250 and I have been having them tested every 6 months for 5 years!
Wife Dx: Jul/09. Age: 37. Size: 3cm. BRCA: -ve. Lumpectomy: Aug/09. Micromet 1/9 node. Chemo Start: Sep/09. E5103. DD ACB-> DD Abraxane (Taxol reaction). Zometa (S0307). Canadian Fraction Rads.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote unklez Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec 29 2009 at 8:37pm
Ms. Bliss,

Yes, there is a school of thought that believes that copper contributes to tumor growth. In fact a Phase II trial at Weill Cornell in NYC has been testing precisely this hypothesis for the last 2 years using a compound called TM, which is known to deplete the copper in the body.

Wife Dx: Jul/09. Age: 37. Size: 3cm. BRCA: -ve. Lumpectomy: Aug/09. Micromet 1/9 node. Chemo Start: Sep/09. E5103. DD ACB-> DD Abraxane (Taxol reaction). Zometa (S0307). Canadian Fraction Rads.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 123Donna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec 29 2009 at 9:35pm
Unklez,

Any research about zinc contributing to tumor growth?

Donna
DX IDC TNBC 6/09 age 49, Stage 1,Grade 3, 1.5cm,0/5Nodes,KI-67 48%,BRCA-,6/09bi-mx, recon, T/C X4(9/09)
11/10 Recur IM node, Gem,Carb,Iniparib 12/10,MRI NED 2/11,IMRT Radsx40,CT NED11/13,MRI NED3/15

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Nancy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec 29 2009 at 9:56pm
Copper and zinc
 
 
 
zinc
 
Researchers at Pennsylvania State University have reported that glands in the breast have unique zinc requirements resulting from their need to transfer extraordinary amounts of zinc into milk during lactation. When nursing women's breasts are deficient in zinc, the result can be severe zinc deficiency in the infant, resulting in impaired growth and development. When zinc is deficient or not properly metabolized, breast cancer is often an additional outcome. Lack of zinc has been implicated not only in the initiation of breast cancer, but also in the transition, progression, and metastasis of the disease. When zinc is deficient, cellular functioning in the breast is compromised. (Genes and Nutrition, April 2)
 

The primary gene protecting women from breast cancer, p53, is thought to be the most frequently mutated or altered gene in the development of cancer. This gene requires zinc, and if it is missing, the gene becomes mutated, resulting in it becoming inactivated or suppressed. Dysfunction of p53 is well documented in the development of breast cancer, indicating that a zinc deficiency is a risk factor for breast cancer independent of the levels of boron, copper and calcium.

http://www.naturalnews.com/026321_zinc_cancer_selenium.html
Nancy
DD Lori dx TNBC June 13,2007
Lumpectomy due to incorrect dx of a cyst
mastectomy July 6 2007
chemo ACT all 3 every 3 weeks 6 tx Aug-Nov
28 rads ended Jan 2008
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123Donna View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 123Donna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec 29 2009 at 10:55pm
Nancy,

Once again thanks for the valuable information.  So my take is that we should avoid supplements (multivitamins) with copper.  And that zinc and selenium in our diets help fight bc.

Donna
DX IDC TNBC 6/09 age 49, Stage 1,Grade 3, 1.5cm,0/5Nodes,KI-67 48%,BRCA-,6/09bi-mx, recon, T/C X4(9/09)
11/10 Recur IM node, Gem,Carb,Iniparib 12/10,MRI NED 2/11,IMRT Radsx40,CT NED11/13,MRI NED3/15

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Nancy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec 29 2009 at 11:22pm
Donna,
 
One more article and yes the date is 2000, but this is from The Life Extension Foundation. 
 
 
A short paragraph from this link...
 
In a previous study, explains lead researcher Dr. George Brewer, professor of human genetics and internal medicine at the university, they tested the copper-lowering drug’s ability to prevent cancer development. The researchers examined its effects in 37 mice carrying the breast cancer gene (BRAC), by giving TM to 22 of the mice for 275 days, while comparing them to 15 controls. Results indicate that while TM didn’t destroy the cancer cells, which still appeared in clusters, they didn’t proceed to form tumors. The amount of copper reduction that Brewer is referring to, however, doesn’t result in outright deficiency. He says, “Cells have a lower copper requirement than tumors, so what we’re talking about is a chemical copper deficiency as opposed to a clinical copper deficiency.”


Edited by Nancy - Dec 29 2009 at 11:22pm
Nancy
DD Lori dx TNBC June 13,2007
Lumpectomy due to incorrect dx of a cyst
mastectomy July 6 2007
chemo ACT all 3 every 3 weeks 6 tx Aug-Nov
28 rads ended Jan 2008
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dmwolf Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec 30 2009 at 1:18am
Tumors are hungry, right, so aren't they happy to eat most anything?    I wouldn't drop anything out of my diet on this basis (or take supplements either, for that matter, on the basis that whole foods are probably best for us).  Though I do wonder about extreme calorie restriction, since it can prolong lifespan in worms and mice.  Has anyone considered that? 
-Denise
DX 2/08@43 stg II IDC; gr2,0 nodes. Neoadj chemo, first ACx2 (fail) then CarboTaxotereX6(better). Lump, Rads done 11/08; Clodronate. False alarm queen: PetCT lung & TM marker. NED. PBM w/recon 9/10.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 123Donna Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec 30 2009 at 7:57am
Denise,

I've seen a report on TV about people that severely limit their calorie intake in their diet in the hopes of achieving longevity.  They measured every gram of food and intake.  The problem I have is that these people will have to live their entire life doing this and not knowing if it really helps.  While I agree that limiting our calorie intake is good, along with exercising and a healthy lifestyle, extreme calorie restriction seems almost impossible to achieve over the long run.  Look at how many people start a diet and/or exercise program as part of their New Year's resolution only to go back to their old habits a few weeks later.  My two cents - Life is too short not to eat cake (and chocolate, wine, etc.).

Donna
DX IDC TNBC 6/09 age 49, Stage 1,Grade 3, 1.5cm,0/5Nodes,KI-67 48%,BRCA-,6/09bi-mx, recon, T/C X4(9/09)
11/10 Recur IM node, Gem,Carb,Iniparib 12/10,MRI NED 2/11,IMRT Radsx40,CT NED11/13,MRI NED3/15

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mainsailset Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec 30 2009 at 10:39am
Thanks Nancy and all for links and information. As I've been saying, the chemo wrecks havoc on our bodies, and in my case the Sutent impacted my thyroid. My cholesterol has gone up 10 pts for the tri, the LDL has gone up 107 pts, the HDL 12 pts and there's no doubt in my mind that the thyroid & the Vit D have both been involved.
All this with a low fat diet and hiking 2 hours a day! So all I'm saying is be aware of what's going on and that it will take your body time and care to achieve a balance again.
 
dx 7/08 TN 14x6.5x5.5 cm tumor

3 Lymph nodes involved, Taxol/Sunitab+AC, 5/09 dbl masectomy, path 2mm tumor removed, lymphs all clear, RAD 32 finished 9/11/09. 9/28 CT clear 10/18/10 CT clear
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Scott Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec 30 2009 at 10:50am

Zinc...or not to zinc, I'm beginning to get confused.

Scott
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mainsailset Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec 30 2009 at 11:14am
Scott, my CalMag does not have zinc in it. It's my understanding that women with breast cancer often have a high level of zinc and copper. When in doubt, my resolve is just to go with the RDA that is already in your supplements. It is indeed frustrating to try and figure all this out, confusion is our companion in all this, but if you stick to an RDA level you'll be ok. Mine is the Carlson brand for what it's worth. Besides, once you figure the zinc out there's bound to be a whole line up of new supplement questions waiting for your attention. Wish I could help more.
dx 7/08 TN 14x6.5x5.5 cm tumor

3 Lymph nodes involved, Taxol/Sunitab+AC, 5/09 dbl masectomy, path 2mm tumor removed, lymphs all clear, RAD 32 finished 9/11/09. 9/28 CT clear 10/18/10 CT clear
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dmwolf Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Dec 30 2009 at 12:39pm
Donna, I'm with you, a cake eater (and pie, and ice cream...) but I do wonder about the low low cal diets.  I've heard of these people too, and their lives seemed less than enviable to me as well.  They seemed to me to be anorexics with a rationalization.  But with cancer in the picture, my views are more malleable. 
DX 2/08@43 stg II IDC; gr2,0 nodes. Neoadj chemo, first ACx2 (fail) then CarboTaxotereX6(better). Lump, Rads done 11/08; Clodronate. False alarm queen: PetCT lung & TM marker. NED. PBM w/recon 9/10.
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