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Adriamycin

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Forum Name: TNBC Metastasis/Recurrence Users
Forum Description: A place to discuss metastatic disease
URL: http://forum.tnbcfoundation.org/forum_posts.asp?TID=8442
Printed Date: Mar 28 2024 at 2:04pm
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Topic: Adriamycin
Posted By: Horse Lover
Subject: Adriamycin
Date Posted: May 10 2011 at 2:50pm
Several survivors relate being treated with adriamycin. My docs at UCLA and here in Las Vegas tell me that recent research indicates that it is not successful and does pose greater risks than the other toxic mixes that I am getting (cytoxane and dosetaxel). Any input on this?

Also: Here's a May 5 article on TNBC research....

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2011/05/110505083228.htm


-------------
57 years old, mother of two daughters. 5/09 lumpectomy, rad; 3/11 C/T 6X, clear scans; 9/11 bilateral/lymph nodes surgery, NED



Replies:
Posted By: Lillie
Date Posted: May 10 2011 at 3:57pm
Dear Horse Lover,
I had adriamycin and I am glad I did. I felt as though I had taken advantage of all that was offered to me almost 5 years ago.

I do realize that it can cause heart problems. I had a muga-scan prior to treatment to see if my heart was strong enough to do adriamycin. It was, and I did. I also had a muga-scan after treatment ended to check the status of my heart.

I can't tell from your signature, but it sounds as though you are stage III and taking cytoxin and taxol or taxatere. If I were you, I would be as agressive with treatment as I could be.

So far I have not had a recurrence, but I could. But I've also had almost 5 years cancer free. It's worth the risk, if your body is strong enough.

Just my humble opinion.

God Bless,
Lillie

-------------
Dx 6/06 age 65,IDC-TNBC
Stage IIb,Gr3,2cm,BRCA-
6/06 L/Mast/w/SNB,1of3 Nodes+
6/06 Axl. 9 nodes-
8/8 thru 11/15 Chemo (Clin-Trial) DD A/Cx4 -- DD taxol+gemzar x4
No Rads.
No RECON - 11/2018-12 yrs NED


Posted By: dmwolf
Date Posted: May 10 2011 at 4:29pm
Hi,

Adria is more cardiotoxic than cytoxan or taxol, but it also works well in about 30% of TNs.  At this point, I wouldn't leave it out of treatment unless the cancer was caught early at stage I.   Between the adria and the taxane, you are much more likely to have a good response than with either of them alone.

d



-------------
DX 2/08@43 stg II IDC; gr2,0 nodes. Neoadj chemo, first ACx2 (fail) then CarboTaxotereX6(better). Lump, Rads done 11/08; Clodronate. False alarm queen: PetCT lung & TM marker. NED. PBM w/recon 9/10.


Posted By: Horse Lover
Date Posted: May 10 2011 at 4:33pm
Should I insist? Not sure what to do....

-------------
57 years old, mother of two daughters. 5/09 lumpectomy, rad; 3/11 C/T 6X, clear scans; 9/11 bilateral/lymph nodes surgery, NED


Posted By: Horse Lover
Date Posted: May 10 2011 at 4:37pm
What is a muga-scan, please?

-------------
57 years old, mother of two daughters. 5/09 lumpectomy, rad; 3/11 C/T 6X, clear scans; 9/11 bilateral/lymph nodes surgery, NED


Posted By: conniec
Date Posted: May 10 2011 at 5:42pm
Hi HL,
I also had a muga scan. A dye is injected intravenously and then you go into a scanner that shows your heart function.  I think it takes 10 minutes.  It's painless except for the needle prick.
Connie


-------------
Age 40,
Felt lump 8/20/10
Lumpectomy 9/7
DX 1.5 tumor stg I 9/13 margin not clear
Double MX w/ expanders 10/8
Final tumor size 1.7, 0/3 + nodes
AC-T chemo 11/8 - 2/21
TE/implant exchange 3/29



Posted By: 123Donna
Date Posted: May 10 2011 at 6:47pm
Horse Lover,

Was your recurrence Stage 3?  I agree with Denise that if anything more than Stage 1 Adriamycin should be considered.  Can you get a second opinion regarding treatment?  Wishing you the best!

Donna


-------------
DX IDC TNBC 6/09 age 49, Stage 1,Grade 3, 1.5cm,0/5Nodes,KI-67 48%,BRCA-,6/09bi-mx, recon, T/C X4(9/09)
11/10 Recur IM node, Gem,Carb,Iniparib 12/10,MRI NED 2/11,IMRT Radsx40,CT NED11/13,MRI NED3/15



Posted By: Horse Lover
Date Posted: May 11 2011 at 8:44pm
Hmm. I did get a second opinion. Sounds like I might need a third! My recurrence in stage 3: lymph nodes, chest wall, and breast (3 cm).

Has anyone had the Adriamycin recently? Were the side effects serious?



-------------
57 years old, mother of two daughters. 5/09 lumpectomy, rad; 3/11 C/T 6X, clear scans; 9/11 bilateral/lymph nodes surgery, NED


Posted By: 123Donna
Date Posted: May 11 2011 at 8:55pm
HL,

Have you seen this thread Denise posted about an important new study?

http://forum.tnbcfoundation.org/attention-newbies-important-new-chemo-study_topic7771_page1.html - http://forum.tnbcfoundation.org/attention-newbies-important-new-chemo-study_topic7771_page1.html


-------------
DX IDC TNBC 6/09 age 49, Stage 1,Grade 3, 1.5cm,0/5Nodes,KI-67 48%,BRCA-,6/09bi-mx, recon, T/C X4(9/09)
11/10 Recur IM node, Gem,Carb,Iniparib 12/10,MRI NED 2/11,IMRT Radsx40,CT NED11/13,MRI NED3/15



Posted By: TracyAMac
Date Posted: May 11 2011 at 9:46pm
Dear Horse Lover

I am attaching a summary of a large long term study I posted a while ago  that  may be what your UCLA docs are referring to. It gave some reassurance to those of us who did not receive "A" &TC.  I couldn't have Adria. last year because I recieved the life time limit of it 30 years ago for a prior cancer.  So I had 6 rounds of TC instead of 4.  My onc was the one who identified the study to me however he still uses AC&T as this often seems to be a common protocol. As Lillie said, you want to throw everything you can at a TN situation. 

My experience with Adria. was a long time ago but from reading other posts here some of the side effects haven't changed  e.g. nausea, mouth sores and as the article and other posts identify, there are potential cardio issues

http://jco.ascopubs.org/content/24/34/5381.abstract

Tracy in Toronto



-------------
TN&non-TN tumors April/10 Gr3&2;1 metaplastic
Rmast.1/9 nodes w/isolated t.cells
Taxotere&Cytoxan x6
Bone cancer 1980 age17;surgery&chemo AC+Methotrexate
BRCA-ve
On hormone therapy & Metformin Trial


Posted By: 123Donna
Date Posted: May 11 2011 at 9:50pm
Tracy, your link:

http://jco.ascopubs.org/content/24/34/5381.abstract - http://jco.ascopubs.org/content/24/34/5381.abstract


-------------
DX IDC TNBC 6/09 age 49, Stage 1,Grade 3, 1.5cm,0/5Nodes,KI-67 48%,BRCA-,6/09bi-mx, recon, T/C X4(9/09)
11/10 Recur IM node, Gem,Carb,Iniparib 12/10,MRI NED 2/11,IMRT Radsx40,CT NED11/13,MRI NED3/15



Posted By: TracyAMac
Date Posted: May 11 2011 at 9:54pm
thank you again Donna!!! One of these days I must figure out how to do this on this forum...I can do it on my e-mails but not when on this site!!! 

Tracy in Toronto


-------------
TN&non-TN tumors April/10 Gr3&2;1 metaplastic
Rmast.1/9 nodes w/isolated t.cells
Taxotere&Cytoxan x6
Bone cancer 1980 age17;surgery&chemo AC+Methotrexate
BRCA-ve
On hormone therapy & Metformin Trial


Posted By: Horse Lover
Date Posted: May 12 2011 at 6:37am
Thanks so much! I will discuss with doc later today when I see her! I appreciate the information!

-------------
57 years old, mother of two daughters. 5/09 lumpectomy, rad; 3/11 C/T 6X, clear scans; 9/11 bilateral/lymph nodes surgery, NED


Posted By: 123Donna
Date Posted: May 12 2011 at 7:43am
HL,

Wishing you the best on your upcoming appointment today with your onc.  Keep us posted on what you find out and decide to do.

Donna


-------------
DX IDC TNBC 6/09 age 49, Stage 1,Grade 3, 1.5cm,0/5Nodes,KI-67 48%,BRCA-,6/09bi-mx, recon, T/C X4(9/09)
11/10 Recur IM node, Gem,Carb,Iniparib 12/10,MRI NED 2/11,IMRT Radsx40,CT NED11/13,MRI NED3/15



Posted By: Momof2NJ
Date Posted: May 12 2011 at 9:58am
I did 4 rounds of Adriamycin in Nov/Dec last year for my TN recurrence. My original diagnosis was back in 2008 and it was stage 1, grade 3 TN.  I had Cytoxan and Taxotere for that.  I had a recurrence in september of 2010.  Given the size of my original tumor which was 1.2 cm and the fact that I had multicentric IDC micro tumors in BOTH breasts, protocol was to only to C&T.  In retrospect, I often wonder if I had done adriamycin then if I would have been spared the recurrence.
 
Adriamycin is a harsh drug.  Some women get thru it easily with minimal side effects.  I wasn't one of those.  It did make me very nauseous and no drugs prescribed helped....I tried them all, but I think i was just one of the  unlucky ones.  When I did T&C, Emend and Zofran were great and I was never sick.  The only thing that helped me during adriamycin was medicinal marijuana...it's legal in NJ.  (and this is the first time I've admitted to using med mj in this forum...go me!)
 
But...here I am today...I finished adriamycin, did 3 rounds of taxol and was then switched to Abraxane because I began to get severe neuropathy from the taxol.  Abraxane was extremely kind to me and it left me tired, but I could function and take care of my children.  I'm almost half way thru my radiation treatments (#11 of 38 today).
 
I remember posting here when I was sick as a dog on adriamycin and was considering telling my doctor I wanted to stop.  The wonderful and amazing folks here talked me off the ledge with care and compassion and I finished.  Another reason why I forged on was because of potential trial drugs that I hopefully won't need someday in the future.  Alot of clinical trials have criteria where you must be treated with the "standard" protocol" (adria being one of the standards) in order to qualify for trials with new drugs. 
 
God willing I will remain NED after radiation....I know I take comfort in knowing I won't have any "what if" moments.
 
I don't tell you my story to dissuade you.  I tell it to let you know that you can be stronger than you ever imagined possible....you CAN do it.  Chemo is hard as we can ALL attest to.  But you do it and move forward.  My motivation is my 6 and 9 year old.  I lost my mother at age 9, she was 51, to ovarian cancer and lost my sister to breast cancer when she was only 42.  My children WILL have their mother around and not go thru childhood like I did.  Failure is NOT an option for me.
 
Feeling philosopical today :)
 
love to all,
mary ellen


-------------
2008 BRCA 1+ dx stg 1,gr 3 IDC triple neg. BM w/ recon. CT x 4. Prophy TAH 2007. Recurrence 9/13/10. 10/5/10 tumor excised. ACx4, Taxol x3, abraxane x 9. 38 rads. 7/11 NED!!!


Posted By: Horse Lover
Date Posted: May 16 2011 at 11:32am
I want to see NED after my name, too!!! So many people that I meet just tell me about the horror stories of those that did not survive. Argh. Again, my doc did not want me to take the Andro, and I am not "qualified" for any clinical studies. The 3.1 cm has gone down to 1.3, and there were no tumors evident in my chest wall and axcilla on the MRI last week, which is good news. Has anyone seen that email supposedly from Johns Hopkins on cancer, and is any of that valid? I am hesitant to include it in the posting, since I do not want to add any mis-information, but it basically says that you can control cancer through diet. Any thoughts...?





-------------
57 years old, mother of two daughters. 5/09 lumpectomy, rad; 3/11 C/T 6X, clear scans; 9/11 bilateral/lymph nodes surgery, NED


Posted By: Charlene
Date Posted: May 16 2011 at 11:57am

You might want to check out lbbc.org or hormonenegativeblogspot.com.  There were two recent teleconferences about TNBC and diet and exercise were mentioned in both.  You can listen to the actual programs on lbbc.org or read a summary at the other site.  Basically what was said was that the "anti-cancer diet" is not much different from what is recommended for everyone.  Good for overall health, which may play a role, but so far no actual proof that they prevent recurrence.  Best wishes to you as you complete your treatment and get to NED!

Charlene 


-------------
DX 3/10 @59 ILC/TNBC
Stage 1, Grade 2, Multifocal; Lumpectomy/re-excision
SNB 0/4 nodes, BRCA-; Taxotere/Cytoxan X4, 30 rads
3/14:NED


Posted By: Horse Lover
Date Posted: May 16 2011 at 12:56pm
Thanks! I appreciate the resource and the encouragement!

-------------
57 years old, mother of two daughters. 5/09 lumpectomy, rad; 3/11 C/T 6X, clear scans; 9/11 bilateral/lymph nodes surgery, NED


Posted By: Lillie
Date Posted: May 16 2011 at 1:25pm
Hi Horse Lover,
I do believe our diet plays a big part in so many of our health issues; diabetes, cholesterol, heart disease, obesity, cancer, etc. I will agree with Charlene in that (concerning cancer recurrence) "once the horse is out of the barn door" it (may be) too late to close the gate. I do believe it is in our favor at all times to be diet conscious. (I wish I could claim to do this as I should, but I can't).....

Good luck with your treatments. I'm praying that your tumor will shrink into oblivion and you will be "dancing with that handsome NED" in the near future.

God Bless,
Lillie

-------------
Dx 6/06 age 65,IDC-TNBC
Stage IIb,Gr3,2cm,BRCA-
6/06 L/Mast/w/SNB,1of3 Nodes+
6/06 Axl. 9 nodes-
8/8 thru 11/15 Chemo (Clin-Trial) DD A/Cx4 -- DD taxol+gemzar x4
No Rads.
No RECON - 11/2018-12 yrs NED


Posted By: Horse Lover
Date Posted: May 18 2011 at 3:42pm
Thanks, Lillie, and everyone else out there! I am thankful for you, for your thoughts, for your sharing, for your bravery, for your caring, for your reaching out, for all of it -- the good, the bad, and the ugly of TNBC. I love you all; thanks for your input and kind thoughts! Going in for Round 3 tomorrow. Then I'll be 50% done...then onward to surgery. 

-------------
57 years old, mother of two daughters. 5/09 lumpectomy, rad; 3/11 C/T 6X, clear scans; 9/11 bilateral/lymph nodes surgery, NED


Posted By: LauraT
Date Posted: May 18 2011 at 6:18pm
Hope Round 3 goes smoothly and with minimal side effects - congrats on getting halfway there!

-------------
DX 10/09 @44, Stage I IDC tnbc, DCIS other side, Neoadjuvant TCx4, Bilateral Mastectomy w/Recon 1/10, 1.2cm 0/7 Nodes, 5/11 Mets to Lungs/Lymph Nodes, Avastin/Taxol, 10/11 Bone Mets, Xgeva


Posted By: TracyAMac
Date Posted: May 22 2011 at 10:56am
Dear Horse Lover

In my pre-BC surgery orientation session, one of the speakers was a dietitian; she confirmed what others have said here that the solid research/longer term studies out there shows no direct correlation of BC with diet and lifestyle factors other than potentially consumption of too much alcohol.  Of course too much alcohol and poor diet and life style choices are not good anyone for a host of other reasons.  So my personal motto is everything in moderation and enjoy life!

Hope your treatments are going smoothly!

Tracy in Toronto


-------------
TN&non-TN tumors April/10 Gr3&2;1 metaplastic
Rmast.1/9 nodes w/isolated t.cells
Taxotere&Cytoxan x6
Bone cancer 1980 age17;surgery&chemo AC+Methotrexate
BRCA-ve
On hormone therapy & Metformin Trial


Posted By: Horse Lover
Date Posted: May 22 2011 at 6:33pm
Tracy: If it was a matter of diet, then we would be so much more in control of the situation! I am sure that there is an impact, but I think a lot of it might be wishful thinking, too.

Cheers! --Rose


-------------
57 years old, mother of two daughters. 5/09 lumpectomy, rad; 3/11 C/T 6X, clear scans; 9/11 bilateral/lymph nodes surgery, NED


Posted By: Lillie
Date Posted: May 23 2011 at 11:27am
Dear Rose (Horse Lover)

I know the past is ancient history, but I am wondering what the staging was on your 2009 diagnosis. Also, (to me) is sounds as though you did not receive "standard of care" treatments. I am deciphering this information from your signature. You may have listed it on another thread, but I missed it. Could you explain more about your initial diagnosis in 2009.

Good luck with the T/C x6 and surgery you are receiving now.

Praying to see NED soon.

God Bless,
Lillie

-------------
Dx 6/06 age 65,IDC-TNBC
Stage IIb,Gr3,2cm,BRCA-
6/06 L/Mast/w/SNB,1of3 Nodes+
6/06 Axl. 9 nodes-
8/8 thru 11/15 Chemo (Clin-Trial) DD A/Cx4 -- DD taxol+gemzar x4
No Rads.
No RECON - 11/2018-12 yrs NED


Posted By: Horse Lover
Date Posted: May 24 2011 at 2:30pm
Thanks, Laura. The glucose IVs help a great deal, as does drinking quarts of filtered water and some rest! God bless you!

-------------
57 years old, mother of two daughters. 5/09 lumpectomy, rad; 3/11 C/T 6X, clear scans; 9/11 bilateral/lymph nodes surgery, NED


Posted By: Horse Lover
Date Posted: May 24 2011 at 2:34pm
Lillie: Thanks for the letting me share my story.
First of all, though, I want everyone to know that I owe everything to Steve (FAWPA) -- the Fearless and Wonderful Patient Advocate.

In April 2009, I moved from Phoenix to Las Vegas to start a new job. The very first week (when benefits started BTW), I noticed a lump and went to my OBGYN who referred me to a breast doc. It took a couple of months, but I was finally diagnosed with stage 1 TNBC, and scheduled for lumpectomy and 6.5 weeks of radiation. At no time was an oncologist called in. At no time was chemotherapy recommended. I had a SNB with topical anesthesia prior to surgery. Plus, there is a discrepancy in the medical records regarding the margins. The pathologist reported that the margins were not differentiated. The surgeon reported that they were clear. The radiologist reported that the tissue was lost and became detached from the specimen. Really?

I had no idea that this situation was abnormal. Life went on.

I felt a lump and the surgeon (let's call him Dr. No), drained fluids twice (12/19 and 1/10). Lost that job and started a new one in January (project manager for online marketing company). Ok; I am feeling tired, but pushing and drinking LOTS of green tea. I felt pain in my breast in 2/11 and went back to Dr. No. After several weeks, had a biopsy (no markers were run by the pathologist for some reason, which is odd). Dr. No recommended mastectomy on right side and reconstruction for March 31. I met with his pal, Dr. Hand, a cosmetic surgeon who specializes in HAND SURGERY. I spoke at length with his nurse, who told me to read the BLOGS on TNBC reconstruction and if I wanted to have DIEP, I needed to go to somewhere like UCLA.

That night, I read and read. I came across Steve's name and contacted him immediately. He got me in to see the docs at UCLA in a matter of DAYS, not weeks. I went to UCLA the next week and got some VERY interesting information. I was stage 3. The cancer had spread to my chest wall and to my lymph nodes, and had tripled in size from what Dr. No reported. Steve was appalled at the lack of care in 2009, as were the docs at UCLA.

No one understood why I had not had a second surgery in 2009 to get clean margins. No one understood why I had not had chemotherapy, a standard practice for TNBC. No one understood why I had not been under the care of an oncologist.

Nonetheless, I got on track with chemotherapy (cytoxen and toxifen 6X) with surgery to come in August (both breasts, two ribs, and lymph nodes). Possibly followed by more chemotherapy. I lost my job.

I cannot travel to UCLA due to the costs, and am having chemotherapy here at the Comprehensive cancer Center of Nevada. Needless to say, there is a HUGE difference in care between the #4 research university in the United States and a corporation. BUT I do have an excellent oncologist who is associated with UCLA and who is doing everything she can to help me. Plus Steve the FAWPA keeps an eye on me.

Today, the glass is half full. We'll see what tomorrow brings, as I live a day at a time.

Thanks, Steve, and to UCLA for saving my life. And FOR ALL OF YOU for caring and being there for me. I LOVE YOU ALLHeart





-------------
57 years old, mother of two daughters. 5/09 lumpectomy, rad; 3/11 C/T 6X, clear scans; 9/11 bilateral/lymph nodes surgery, NED


Posted By: janet c.
Date Posted: May 24 2011 at 3:31pm
Rose,
Too bad you didn't get the chemo the first time but thank God for Steve. It looks like you are responding to the chemo now and I send best wishes and prayers your way.
Janet

-------------
dx 12/08 @47yrs.old TNBC stage 2a grade 3, 2.1cm. partial mastectomy sentinal node negative BRACA negative Cytocan/Taxatere x4 radiation 36 or 38rounds


Posted By: Lillie
Date Posted: May 24 2011 at 3:40pm
Dear Rose,
Reading your story brings me to tears. I am so sorry you were jerked around so much.

Thank God you found TNBC site and most of all Steve. I'm praying for you to be NED....

God Bless,
Lillie

-------------
Dx 6/06 age 65,IDC-TNBC
Stage IIb,Gr3,2cm,BRCA-
6/06 L/Mast/w/SNB,1of3 Nodes+
6/06 Axl. 9 nodes-
8/8 thru 11/15 Chemo (Clin-Trial) DD A/Cx4 -- DD taxol+gemzar x4
No Rads.
No RECON - 11/2018-12 yrs NED


Posted By: 123Donna
Date Posted: May 24 2011 at 3:49pm
Rose,

Thank you for sharing your story.  I'm upset about the lack of care you received in 2009, but glad you found us and especially Steve, who helped guide you to UCLA and better care.  Yes, the glass is half full for you now!

Donna


-------------
DX IDC TNBC 6/09 age 49, Stage 1,Grade 3, 1.5cm,0/5Nodes,KI-67 48%,BRCA-,6/09bi-mx, recon, T/C X4(9/09)
11/10 Recur IM node, Gem,Carb,Iniparib 12/10,MRI NED 2/11,IMRT Radsx40,CT NED11/13,MRI NED3/15



Posted By: Horse Lover
Date Posted: May 25 2011 at 11:15am
"Being defeated is often temporary, giving up makes it permanent."

        - Marilyn Von Savant


-------------
57 years old, mother of two daughters. 5/09 lumpectomy, rad; 3/11 C/T 6X, clear scans; 9/11 bilateral/lymph nodes surgery, NED


Posted By: dmwolf
Date Posted: May 25 2011 at 3:28pm
Rose, I love the quote!

-------------
DX 2/08@43 stg II IDC; gr2,0 nodes. Neoadj chemo, first ACx2 (fail) then CarboTaxotereX6(better). Lump, Rads done 11/08; Clodronate. False alarm queen: PetCT lung & TM marker. NED. PBM w/recon 9/10.


Posted By: KenR
Date Posted: Jun 07 2011 at 6:59pm
My wife had a severe allergic reaction to her second Taxotere (TC) chemo which looked exactly like Hand and Foot Syndrome but, according to our onc, wasnt.  So, she put her on Adriamycin.  I insisted on a echocardiogram which my cardiologist said would tell us what we needed to know (vs. muga), which she "passed".  The AC chemo made her more fatigued than the TC but no other significantly different side effects.  No nausea (with emend and zofran), etc.  She had lost her hair, her nails were mildly effected, oh, she suddenly lost her eyebrows.  I guess that was different.  But she is an incredibly strong woman who doesnt complain either.


Posted By: Horse Lover
Date Posted: Jun 08 2011 at 10:11am
Thank you for your support and encouragement. I am steeling myself for round 4 C/T tomorrow. I have a long list of questions for my onc, ranging from CTC, CRP, entinostat.....Thanks for educating me on so many topics. I now do regular searches on the forums and am really picking up a great deal of helpful information!

"Believe you can and you're halfway there."

        - Theodore Roosevelt



-------------
57 years old, mother of two daughters. 5/09 lumpectomy, rad; 3/11 C/T 6X, clear scans; 9/11 bilateral/lymph nodes surgery, NED



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